Questioning knowledge...

[josteele]

I would like to know what is the difference between knowledge and the application of knowledge? Or is there no difference?
Does the mere accumulation of knowledge mean that one automatically knows how and when this knowledge should be applied?
Also, Can one be learned without the other?
Why would knowledge and its application be separated when being taught in the first place?

[josteele]

Example: Can one learn all the facts about Black history and never come to the conclusion of what it means and how it can be used?

[rebelAfrika]

I would like to know what is the difference between knowledge and the application of knowledge? Or is there no difference?
Does the mere accumulation of knowledge mean that one automatically knows how and when this knowledge should be applied?
Also, Can one be learned without the other?
Why would knowledge and its application be separated when being taught in the first place?

Very philosophical. Just off of a cursory glance of what you are asking, I can think of a proponderance of arguments that go both ways. Meaning that I can see how it can be argued that knowledge and the application of knowledge can be two seperate and distinct things...and I can also see how knowledge and the application of knowledge are inherently inseperable. My mind is heavily preoccupied with studying law at the moment though, so I cannot really answer your questions...but if you have any questions about civil and/or criminal litigation...holla at ya boy .

[naturallyme]

well let's see...i don't think the accumulation and the application of knowledge are separate. acquiring knowledge, and doing absolutely nothing with it, is a form of application. you are always doing something, even when you are doing nothing.

in a sense, the question seems to imply that there is a proper way of application. however, the HOW and WHEN (to apply that knowledge) is relative, and therefore would depend on the individual.

however, with enough knowledge accumilation, and depending on one's intent in acquiring the knowledge, or simply, life goals, one can learn through historical knowledge, of ways, and times that have failed, and one can attempt to predict which HOWs and WHENs that would better aid in said person's intentions and achievement of goals.

I would like to know what is the difference between knowledge and the application of knowledge? Or is there no difference?
Does the mere accumulation of knowledge mean that one automatically knows how and when this knowledge should be applied?
Also, Can one be learned without the other?
Why would knowledge and its application be separated when being taught in the first place?

[Tumi]

Knowledge comes to us as we seek it, it comes to us as we need it, it also comes to us as we make steps towards it. This includes the knowledge brought by the ancestors as they see fit, However one can also accumilate knowledge with the force of trying to enlighten oneself, insuch a case, how one approach circumstances and subsequently apply knowledge, has indirect relation to what and how much of knowledge does one posses, within the essence of that question, arise the impetus of what and how much knowledge, relative to ones sorrounding, does one need to possess, also to ask for what purposes, thereby identifying the structure of application to carefully fit into what is being apllied for. It is known to be WISE in AFRIKA, if an individual knows what to do, when and how. What is necessarily common (within the Afrikan society) is that, in the process of acquiring and applying, runs a thread of patience that must be maintained, as knowing can be both destructive and contructive to oneself and the community. The art of hiding knowledge from the rest of the community has been practised for the purpose of pre-emting any form of destruction that the knowledge bears. This then in it essence is a form of application that is selfless and defiant to the knowledge itself.

Knowledge is passive wherelse knowledge application is active. Another testimony from the elders: everytime we sit with our elders, they always emphasize how much we should learn to listen to what they say and refrain from doing what they do, especialy in circumstances where one has failed to put their knowledge into the practice of prosperity. I hope i tried to distinguish the two with an Afrikan presence.

[Tumi]

Knowledge comes to us as we seek it, it comes to us as we need it, it also comes to us as we make steps towards it. This includes the knowledge brought by the ancestors as they see fit, However one can also accumilate knowledge with the force of trying to enlighten oneself, insuch a case, how one approach circumstances and subsequently apply knowledge, has indirect relation to what and how much of knowledge does one posses, within the essence of that question, arise the impetus of what and how much knowledge, relative to ones sorrounding, does one need to possess, also to ask for what purposes, thereby identifying the structure of application to carefully fit into what is being apllied for. It is known to be wise in AFRIKA, if an individual knows what to do, when and how. What is necessarily common (within the Afrikan society) is that, in the process of acquiring and applying, runs a thread of patience that must be maintained, as knowing can be both destructive and contructive to oneself and the community. The art of hiding knowledge from the rest of the community has been practised for the purpose of pre-emting any form of destruction that the knowledge bears. This then in it essence is a form of application that is selfless and defiant to the knowledge itself.

Knowledge is passive wherelse knowledge application is active. Another testimony from the elders: everytime we sit with our elders, they always emphasize how much we should learn to listen to what they say and refrain from doing what they do, especialy in circumstances where one has failed to put their knowledge into the practice of prosperity. I hope i tried to distinguish the two with an Afrikan presence.

[Im The Truth]

"Thought without practice is empty, practice without thought is blind." - Osagyefo Kwame Nkrumah

[josteele]

Knowledge comes to us as we seek it, it comes to us as we need it, it also comes to us as we make steps towards it. This includes the knowledge brought by the ancestors as they see fit, However one can also accumilate knowledge with the force of trying to enlighten oneself, insuch a case, how one approach circumstances and subsequently apply knowledge, has indirect relation to what and how much of knowledge does one posses, within the essence of that question, arise the impetus of what and how much knowledge, relative to ones sorrounding, does one need to possess, also to ask for what purposes, thereby identifying the structure of application to carefully fit into what is being apllied for. It is known to be WISE in AFRIKA, if an individual knows what to do, when and how. What is necessarily common (within the Afrikan society) is that, in the process of acquiring and applying, runs a thread of patience that must be maintained, as knowing can be both destructive and contructive to oneself and the community. The art of hiding knowledge from the rest of the community has been practised for the purpose of pre-emting any form of destruction that the knowledge bears. This then in it essence is a form of application that is selfless and defiant to the knowledge itself.

Knowledge is passive wherelse knowledge application is active. Another testimony from the elders: everytime we sit with our elders, they always emphasize how much we should learn to listen to what they say and refrain from doing what they do, especialy in circumstances where one has failed to put their knowledge into the practice of prosperity. I hope i tried to distinguish the two with an Afrikan presence.

This was a very informative post!!!
I would like to know if you have any idea of what causes the difference you described between being WISE and possessing KNOWLEDGE? Or, in other words why isnt the accumulation of knowledge automatically teaching one the proper usage of this info? (taking desires out of the equation).

[josteele]

well let's see...i don't think the accumulation and the application of knowledge are separate. acquiring knowledge, and doing absolutely nothing with it, is a form of application. you are always doing something, even when you are doing nothing.

in a sense, the question seems to imply that there is a proper way of application. however, the HOW and WHEN (to apply that knowledge) is relative, and therefore would depend on the individual.

however, with enough knowledge accumilation, and depending on one's intent in acquiring the knowledge, or simply, life goals, one can learn through historical knowledge, of ways, and times that have failed, and one can attempt to predict which HOWs and WHENs that would better aid in said person's intentions and achievement of goals.

I dont agree with the point you made about not using knowledge is a form of application. The word apply intels some sort of usage, you example doesnt consist of any form of usage.
Whether or not there is a proper way of application is besides the question. Lets say you know the hight of a building and the length of its shadow, how can you apply this knowledge to find the angle the sun is above the object. The simple answer says a basic trigonometry can tell you percisely what the answer was. The goal is already pre-determined, yet there is still a separation between the knowledge we have and the way we needed to apply it to obtain our specific goal. This example also shows the FACT that knowledge and its application are indeed separated, if only by its level of understanding.

[josteele]

Very philosophical. Just off of a cursory glance of what you are asking, I can think of a proponderance of arguments that go both ways. Meaning that I can see how it can be argued that knowledge and the application of knowledge can be two seperate and distinct things...and I can also see how knowledge and the application of knowledge are inherently inseperable. My mind is heavily preoccupied with studying law at the moment though, so I cannot really answer your questions...but if you have any questions about civil and/or criminal litigation...holla at ya boy .

You gone be a lawyer? Ive been told that I shoulda went down that route, but bein ignorant and hard-headed led me in another direction. I definatly could use the skillz of a lawyer on my team, or however that go.

[rebelAfrika]

You gone be a lawyer?

Eventually. Yeah.

Ive been told that I shoulda went down that route, but bein ignorant and hard-headed led me in another direction.

What direction are you going now? Because it seems to me you are pretty young and it's not too late for you to change directions (if thats what you truly wanted to do).

I definatly could use the skillz of a lawyer on my team, or however that go.

Couldn't we all. I'm not even in law school yet and I'm already networking with lawyers.

[naturallyme]

josteele,

i see what you're saying, and based on your example, i would like to point out a few things. let me just say that i just finished typing out this LONG response, and i accidently closed my browser. anyway...

i stated that not doing is a form of doing, which you happen to disagree with. i suppose we can agree to disagree on this. i personally believe that not doing is a form of doing, and therefore if one is doing nothing, one is still in the act of doing (something). if i possess knowledge, and i decide NOT to apply it, i am still applying it simply because i am in the act of not doing which is a form of doing. This then begs the question of how one determines/measures the application of knowledge. Is it by intention or results? My personal belief is that it is by intention. It is probably more practical to measure application by results tho. So I can see both being useful.

Is there a separation between knowledge possession and application? There can be. As long as there is no intention whatsoever, then knowledge and its application will be separate. Intention is what really connects knowledge and application. It is also what makes PROPER application relevant. Just like I stated in my earlier post when I said, “however, with enough knowledge accumilation, and depending on one's intent in acquiring the knowledge, or simply, life goals, one can learn through historical knowledge, of ways, and times that have failed, and one can attempt to predict which HOWs and WHENs that would better aid in said person's intentions and achievement of goals.�

Let me use your example to try and explain myself.

If one possesses the knowledge of a certain building’s height, and its shadow’s length and that’s it, then this is where there is a separation between knowledge and application. However, once the goal, as you mention, or the intention is introduced into the equation, then everything changes. Because there is an intention, then it makes sense that one would properly apply their knowledge to achieve desired results. One will probably want to consider other factors including time and distance. This is where the PROPER application of knowledge becomes relevant. If one’s goal was to measure the weather at that building, then using trig would not be very useful. Also, one would not need to apply knowledge, unless one had an intention. Due to this, knowledge and its application are directly correlated, and therefore, not separate. One cannot exist without the other, as long as an intention/goal exists.

I dont agree with the point you made about not using knowledge is a form of application. The word apply intels some sort of usage, you example doesnt consist of any form of usage.
Whether or not there is a proper way of application is besides the question. Lets say you know the hight of a building and the length of its shadow, how can you apply this knowledge to find the angle the sun is above the object. The simple answer says a basic trigonometry can tell you percisely what the answer was. The goal is already pre-determined, yet there is still a separation between the knowledge we have and the way we needed to apply it to obtain our specific goal. This example also shows the FACT that knowledge and its application are indeed separated, if only by its level of understanding.

[SASAFRAS]

I thought long and hard then I remembered an article that might be of use to share.


Your hearts know in silence the secrets of the days and the nights.

But your ears thirst for the sound of your heart's knowledge.

You would know in words that which you have always know in thought.

You would touch with your fingers the naked body of your dreams.

And it is well you should.

The hidden well-spring of your soul must needs rise and run murmuring to the sea;

And the treasure of your infinite depths would be revealed to your eyes.

But let there be no scales to weigh your unknown treasure;

And seek not the depths of your knowledge with staff or sounding line.

For self is a sea boundless and measureless.

Say not, "I have found the truth," but rather, "I have found a truth."

Say not, "I have found the path of the soul." Say rather, "I have met the soul walking upon my path."

For the soul walks upon all paths.

The soul walks not upon a line, neither does it grow like a reed.

The soul unfolds itself, like a lotus of countless petals.

[Tumi]

Knowledge defined as the possession of information, facts, ideas, truths, or principles, does not guarantee one, the very widsom of application. The reasoning to this, from an Afrikan centered perspective, is that the systematic processes and techniques deployed in the acquiring of information has a fundamental difference from the act of applying that information. I'm using the word "information" becouse it is the root and indication of knowledge, knowing is being in possesion of a particurlar information that would ENABLE you to perform certain tasks with eaze, yet those tasks being tangible and physical, demands the passiveness of theory(knowing) and the specified instruments to actively derive at the ultimate result required. NDHIVO na VUTALI(Knowledge and Wisdom) are necessary to juxtapose, as one supports the other especialy in the position of leadership.

[josteele]

josteele,

i see what you're saying, and based on your example, i would like to point out a few things. let me just say that i just finished typing out this LONG response, and i accidently closed my browser. anyway...

i stated that not doing is a form of doing, which you happen to disagree with. i suppose we can agree to disagree on this. i personally believe that not doing is a form of doing, and therefore if one is doing nothing, one is still in the act of doing (something). if i possess knowledge, and i decide NOT to apply it, i am still applying it simply because i am in the act of not doing which is a form of doing. This then begs the question of how one determines/measures the application of knowledge. Is it by intention or results? My personal belief is that it is by intention. It is probably more practical to measure application by results tho. So I can see both being useful.

Is there a separation between knowledge possession and application? There can be. As long as there is no intention whatsoever, then knowledge and its application will be separate. Intention is what really connects knowledge and application. It is also what makes PROPER application relevant. Just like I stated in my earlier post when I said, “however, with enough knowledge accumilation, and depending on one's intent in acquiring the knowledge, or simply, life goals, one can learn through historical knowledge, of ways, and times that have failed, and one can attempt to predict which HOWs and WHENs that would better aid in said person's intentions and achievement of goals.�

Let me use your example to try and explain myself.

If one possesses the knowledge of a certain building’s height, and its shadow’s length and that’s it, then this is where there is a separation between knowledge and application. However, once the goal, as you mention, or the intention is introduced into the equation, then everything changes. Because there is an intention, then it makes sense that one would properly apply their knowledge to achieve desired results. One will probably want to consider other factors including time and distance. This is where the PROPER application of knowledge becomes relevant. If one’s goal was to measure the weather at that building, then using trig would not be very useful. Also, one would not need to apply knowledge, unless one had an intention. Due to this, knowledge and its application are directly correlated, and therefore, not separate. One cannot exist without the other, as long as an intention/goal exists.

The example you used in regards to the building and trig clearly lets us see that particular knowledge can be used for particular things. Or basically with the knowledge of the height of a building and length of the shadow you only have a limited way of applying this info. But learning this info does not tell you the limits of the usages of this info, the varying ways we can use this info must be what Tumi referred to as WISDOM. I dont know if you knew it but the example you gave was great!!! Thanks.