What is struggle?

[Odarquaye]

Greetings Brothers and Sisters,

I would like to get some views on "struggle"
When we talk of struggle what do we actually mean? We know that Africans on the continent and in the disaspora have waged struggle when we refer to the independence movement or civil rights struggle in the US. But what is struggle now.

Aparthied is no more in South Africa (a view of some) but is there still struggle and if so by who?

African Union is becoming more vercifourus. Are the governments in Africa waging struggle against neo-colonialism and imperialism?

What struggles are taking place outside of Africa in the diaspora?

Peace

Odarquaye

[Little95]

Just being Afrikan is the struggle/a struggle!

[IfasehunReincarnated]

i want to start by saying that in my opinion, i would never want my son to grow up thinking being an african is a struggle in itself. this has a diabilitating effect on the psyche and spirit of a man or woman. i want my son to grow up enjoying his identity and not having any baggage associated with it, emotional or otherwise. he can be aware of racism, but in the sense of pitying those around him that exhibit, not fearing or loathing them. i want him to view his identity as a position of strength and any "struggle" waged against him as futile and naive. (as if to say, "how could they ever believe they could keep an african down?")

with that said, struggle is one temporary part of our reality. it is not be romanticized nor put on some pedastal. struggle is one part of restoring balance among our ethnicity. the other part is victory. struggle may also be a bad word, because it sounds neverending. i have no intention of fighting this fight past my children's children. Period. In fact I believe I may see the end in my lifetime. the struggle is any fight against institutional racism or imperialism - the two greatest threats to humanity. each of these is the birth mother of every other problem that plagues humanity: pollution, materialism, sexual depravity, sexism, classism, animal extinction, disease, etc..

The struggle is one to define all of this, but by no means is it the best word. It sounds real negative to me these days, real hopeless and I know our forefathers didnt want us to have a negative outlook. Anything that sounds like "fighting forever" just doesnt float my boat. Thats way too uneffective and it also give way more credit to white folks than I ever intend to do.

[rebelAfrika]

Greetings Brothers and Sisters,

I would like to get some views on "struggle"
When we talk of struggle what do we actually mean? We know that Africans on the continent and in the disaspora have waged struggle when we refer to the independence movement or civil rights struggle in the US. But what is struggle now.

Aparthied is no more in South Africa (a view of some) but is there still struggle and if so by who?

African Union is becoming more vercifourus. Are the governments in Africa waging struggle against neo-colonialism and imperialism?

What struggles are taking place outside of Africa in the diaspora?

Peace

Odarquaye

Struggle is the interaction between opposing forces. If it is not a struggle between "humans versus humans" (example: I am greedy, therefore I must subjegate, oppress, and exploit other people) it is "humanity versus nature" (example: "I am going to figure out a way to live to be 150 years old" or "I am going to find a way to travel to Alpha Centari"). Struggle is eternal. As Fredrick Douglass said "Without struggle, there is no progress."

[IfasehunReincarnated]

do you think that Baba Frederick Douglass (Mojuba t'orun - I praise the honorable ancestors that reside in afterlife) made that comment independent of racism? That is do you think he was specifically discussing the political situation that beset Africans then and now, or that he was giving a general life lesson?

I suppose a western view of life is eternal struggle. but all the elder wisdom of the native americans, african, asians and so on points to a possibility that anyone of us can master ourselves over lifetimes and in doing so, do the right thing at the right time for the right reason. and when we read the words of sages it seems that they keep telling us to calm ourselves, look within and accomplish your role in the divine plan. Does that sound like a struggle or a journey? Well, I guess it could be both depending on how you look at it. Interesting question.

Does anyone think that any of the language that we used has lost its original intent or power? The black and latino drug community has co-opted the term struggle to refer to the desire to stay one step ahead of the feds, police and rival dealers on the road to wealth. I think its disgusting how they do this and I sometimes wonder if its a cowardly way to stay they are just as valid as conscious minded people. Also where do you think terms like black power stand in the psyche of not only black people, but people of the world in general? Anybody ever wonder if words help more than they get in the way?

Good post..

[Kweku_Omowale]

many people struggle in south america and central america, when you go through garbage cans looking for food, looking for cans to sell,or you go to dump sites looking for paper,struggle can take diffrent levels,when welfare cuts you off like they have done here to me,because they want to scrutinize me and they dont scrutinize white hippies when they go through the system, struggle is for me,when you havea racist boss that tells you" why black people get mad when we call them niggers,when they call themselves nigga" struggle is when my indigenous brothers and sisters living on reservations here iand in amerikkka,i have been to reservations and seeing people struggling there,one thing is for damn fuckin sure(sorry for sweariing) just venting out my fustration, when you are brown,black,you are born in the struggle,because social conditions determine awareness,when you are thrown behind bars for speaking about human rights and poverty,you know,you are struggler, just being ourselves isa dayly struggle,fighting against uncle toms, are daly struggle,a working man witha mortgage and kids also struggle,because he can be living from pay check to pay check and may end up in the bread lines,that junkee in the streets,trying to numb his pain,is also struggling to cope with lifes most diffucult challenges,poverty,racism,police state,those are my views on struggle,my friends

[rebelAfrika]

do you think that Baba Frederick Douglass (Mojuba t'orun - I praise the honorable ancestors that reside in afterlife) made that comment independent of racism? That is do you think he was specifically discussing the political situation that beset Africans then and now, or that he was giving a general life lesson?

I suppose a western view of life is eternal struggle. but all the elder wisdom of the native americans, african, asians and so on points to a possibility that anyone of us can master ourselves over lifetimes and in doing so, do the right thing at the right time for the right reason. and when we read the words of sages it seems that they keep telling us to calm ourselves, look within and accomplish your role in the divine plan. Does that sound like a struggle or a journey? Well, I guess it could be both depending on how you look at it. Interesting question.

Does anyone think that any of the language that we used has lost its original intent or power? The black and latino drug community has co-opted the term struggle to refer to the desire to stay one step ahead of the feds, police and rival dealers on the road to wealth. I think its disgusting how they do this and I sometimes wonder if its a cowardly way to stay they are just as valid as conscious minded people. Also where do you think terms like black power stand in the psyche of not only black people, but people of the world in general? Anybody ever wonder if words help more than they get in the way?

Good post..

I think that Fredrick Douglass' comment was transcendental. I don't even want to go into all the comments Kwame Ture made about "struggle," so lets just say I do not believe that struggle is a "bad" thing. It's just that some of the things that we struggle with are matters of human necessities. Thats just my opinion though.

[IfasehunReincarnated]

word. (no pun intended. lol) zumbi definately brings home the point on the reality of life for lots of people. hoping more people offer their opinions on all the points mentioned so far. good thread!

[Odarquaye]

Greetings Africans,

I am encouraged by the many responses and views around 'struggle' which can also have connatations of a negative outlook but reality is that the majority of Africans on whichever continent face poverty and racism.

The concept put by IfasehunReincarnated that 'Anything that sounds like "fighting forever" just doesnt float my boat' is a potent statement. The fact is that some Africans working for social change do indeed think that in their lifetime they will not see the fall of capitalism and social change for the benefit of the majority of Africans, but one must also realise that it is a contribution. So fighting forever is not something anybody can comprehend but fighting forever in 'this lifetime' is a reality.

I would also say that struggle is real. There are organised forces who are fighting for social change in African and the diaspora and we should recognize this as practical and real.

Peace

Odarquaye

[IfasehunReincarnated]

w/o a doubt Odarquaye. racism and imperialism are very real. and perhaps i will not see it begin to fall in my lifetime. but i believe we pass on that "not while i am alive" theory, which can be self-fulfilling. there is some reason why Africans living in european countries have never gotten as far as others in obtaining their freedom. i wonder aloud, if our language contributes to that. and if focusing on our suffering as opposed to what we would prefer to have in life is a contributing factor as well.

a lot of you know i do community development and engagement for a living. i essentially work with resident groups and local nonprofits to solve problems that have been ignored or bandaged with temporary solutions over the years.

example, this morning @ 9am I will be meeting with a group of residents and a local nonprofit to establish a micro-entreprise loan/grant program, just for low-income residents. the nonprofit gets the money through a grant, then makes loans to first-time or small business owners that are low-income. these entrepreneurs will get loans on average from $2,000-7,000 to start or maintain small businesses in "the hood". I am talking welfare recepients, single mothers, seniors ex-thugs etc.. - anyone with a viable idea. They will even get help with their business plans and get free financial and legal help in establishing their businesses. We also have a seperate pot of money to make grants out of, so the applicant gets a loan (below market rate) and a grant which they never have to repay back.

Next week I am hosting the 1st gathering of the Resident Accountability Board. Working with Family Court we get to review cases of 1st time non-violent offenders, give them a community sentence and if they complete it, wipe their record of the arrest and waive all charges. So we get to keep kids out of the system and keep the charges to a minimum. If they need support we refer them to job training, GED, drug/alcohol rehab - basically whatever they cant afford or dont know how to find on their own.

why do i share these examples? because i "think" if each of us can find practical ways of helping our communities right now, we can heal some of the hopelessness that comes with "struggle". remember, the Black Panthers STARTED before/after schoolcare when they began the breakfast and inner city after school sites. you could look at that as say "how does that contribute to permanent freedom?" and that would be naive. because what comes after freedom, if we are all emotionally broken, tired and uneducated? you cant build a nation without brainpower or muscle. also, we need these kinds of programs so that we dont lose people to the system before we ever get to freedom! a lot of people are under the impression that the Panthers, SNCC etc did all this work totally off of community contributions. in some cases that true. and I dig too. when I was in college we ran an underground newspaper with at least an 800 person circulation (in Nashville in 1990 that would be a big deal, trust me) totally off individual donations of $1.00 or less. i mean we knocked door to door, held out cups at universities, etc.. but, i want people to know, i manage everyday to use any dollars - federal, state, private foundation etc. to pull off good programs that help black people and i NEVER have to compromise my values or my intentions. so i hope more of us start to look at not only solutions for tomorrow, but solutions for today, that make struggle more bearable and victory much closer.

[Odarquaye]

Greetings

It is useful for people to show what practical things can be done to develop social change amongst Africans. thank you for this.

Africans whereever there are can contribute to raising the awareness of the plight of Africans in their locality and also abroad. This is important because an international network needs to be developed from the grassroots up.

You say "why Africans living in european countries have never gotten as far as others in obtaining their freedom". I am not 100% clear on this. Do you mean Africans living in Europe only (where I am based) or do you include Africans in the US as compared to Africans on the continent. I am reluctant to make comparisons because it is relative.

What I would like to add is that it is through practical work that I believe aids our political development and one can only start in their locality.

Peace

Odarquaye
African Liberation Support Campaign Network (ALISC Network)
http://www.aliscnetwork.org

[Kweku_Omowale]

also remember people that the struggle makes the man, what ever we endure in life,makes us stronger,the saying goes"whatever doesnt kill you,makes you stronger" and that holds true,for me, i can adapt to any situation and i go to survival mode,

[rebelAfrika]

also remember people that the struggle makes the man, what ever we endure in life,makes us stronger,the saying goes"whatever doesnt kill you,makes you stronger" and that holds true,for me, i can adapt to any situation and i go to survival mode,

PERFECT! EVERY POINT YOU MADE WAS PERFECT!

[Kerileng-Blackrose]

with love and light...id like to join in an share my opinions on struggle!
what is struggle ...i believe struggle is all the trouble we've seen, been and experienced and continue to experience as a black nation.
life should be a celebration ,but to me at this current point a lot remains a mistery ,for how? when? and why? we find ourselves in these paining realities we face each and everyday of our lives.
they came and introduced slavery accompanied by oppression,discrimination and by degrading us and leading us to believe we are inferior!
well fuck that...appologies a sister's gotta let it all out...
these very ways ideas and systems they brought with them to afrika/ancestors shipped to amerika in the first place is what our situations troubles problems stresses concerns fears and tears are all about in these days!
we worry about having a piece of bread in the house..to feed our families
our parents work monday to sunday's hardworkers from day one to support us ...but still thats not enough cause we cheated constantly cheap labour...still very much alive and so we continue to strive to feed our young and keep our race alive!
some of us have to drop out of school to go work and be providers cause if we dont make the sacrifices ,mind you we were very much inconvenienced by the white race,but if we dont get up and work and look out for the rest of us
whose gonna give us life and another day
money money money...they say it makes the world go round..
i worry cause in this sick world we live in and ills masterminded and created by the oppressors money seems to be the only way for us to get by and grow.
in south africa for example most of us cant even go to university or technikon cause its so mother fucken expensive,our mothers and fathers work all their lives,but still the majority of blacks cant afford it.
bursaries seemed like the solution and other way out..but please they have "requirements and standards of all sorts for us to be educated.
and these are all forms of systems created to oppress us and defeat us.

brothers and sisters we are drug dealing and robbing banks still in the 21st century..this simply still proves and shows us that things are still very wrong and out of place..why else would we be resolving to selling drugs...and stealing from banks taking risks with our lives everyday,getting chased and shot at by the police...they killing us slowly....but not surely...cause we still standing and fighting.
all the things we do and paths we choose and ways we have resorted to,its not just for fun or by choice..have you ever seen a smile on a drug dealers face...when our brothers go on missions and cash in they dont carry smiles on their faces ..we accompanied by frowns and frustrations.
its our circumstances situations and communities...the shape they're in.
little children dont go to school cause they cant afford school uniforms and books...what kinda bullshit is that...
aids is killing our brothers and sisters ,its killing us raping us everyday the numbers are increasing...in black people left to die ,cause well oh well,they cant be helped saved or attended to WHY?cause because anti retroviral drugs<AZT>are being sold to the people and victims of aids.and the prices for these drugs to help one carry on living a little while longer with the disease are sky high..we dont have money to eat and they expect us to have money to maintain<babysit> a disease until we die..i ask GOD WHY..he let the white man lie to us so over and over and over again.
aids is one of the many ills that threaten and weaken us,and everyday in the news,papers,at home,the woman or man next door,in our neighbouring countries in afrika in amerika townships ghettos...if we are not affected we need to be concerned.
the stories our grandparents mothers and fathers told us about their days in the struggle...have not changed for today we their grandchildren and children
are still struggling to be free and entitled to be black and live in a free world
all these oppressions and forms of manipulations...we need to be finding solutions to fast...
we cant let nor allow the past history repeat itselve...no we cant
the extreme difference in social/racial classes and our lifestyles..this says something too.
blacks reside in townships/ghettos/slums/shacks/deserted lands"they call them farms"but nothing grows or lives there but a community of 50 blacks stuck in poverty.
whats happening in amerika and the systems that disrespect my people and attempt to fuck around and mess about in our business and lives.
in south africa yes well it is said apartheid is over ...we have had two black presidents in the last couple of years.

u BABA our hero yes indeed he set us free from the whiteness and their poison,he broke the chains..MY1ST BLACK PRESIDENT IN S.A MR NELSON MANDELA u MADIBA u RHOLIHLAHLA he showed and proved to us that it can be done.
for how long can it go on..have white men fucking us up and running our countries and stealing all our riches and treasures.
we have a another black president in s.a MR THABO MBEKI, he's a good man and he's trying but clearly not enough..cause life in the townships and in our streets its still mother fucken tough.
iam still trying to figure it out ,i wish i could walk right straight into parliament
stare my president in they eye..and ask him if he's blind ,cause though its all black and proud in s.a its like a joke..most people in parliament have personal agendas of getting whats theirs be on their way to riches leading the good life...while the rest of us black people still trying damn hard and wonder if we'll make it to the next day.
if you worry, about tomorrow
if you worry, about the survival of our people
if you worry, cause the future looks blurry
if you worry, about another brother or sister if they have something to eat
if you worry,about the child whose parents are dead or busy dying of aids
if you worry, cause you weary ,eyes teary and have fears ,as you wonder whats become of this world and of us
if you worry, and are fighting whilst trying to ensure that no white man burry us and all that we are and represent!BLACK ON PURPOSE AND BLACK AND
PROUD...

these are our struggles and my opinions on STRUGGLE..MAYIBUYE I AFRIKA NABANTWANA BAYO <let afrika return and let its children return back home> VIVA KUZONYIWA SESIFIKILE<shit is gonna burst out for we are here and we are united in our struggle..we are ready

yes we were born into struggle ,but the struggle doesnt have to go on forever,especially with all of us here...we are learning and seeing more so discovering one another...now we need to help one another get up and go on.
we know and are ready...lets save our people, children, parents, grandparents and unborn babies...lets eliminate these sick and heartbreaking realities we are faced with everyday...i pray and am hopeful that most of us if we start acting and building each educating one another..we'll live to see the day..
when things start getting better where things are changing..and more black people having reasons to be smiling..

[Ready4Revolution]

for me it would seem hard for anyone who considers him/herself a revolutionary to seperate life and struggle, because in my eyes a revolutionaries life is a constant struggle, fighting imperialism, white supremacy, capitalism, european cultural incarceration, kwame ture, would always say "as revolutionary we dont run away from struggle we run towards it."

ready for revolution